Tannins- Best way to remove them?

[Gary Slusser]

Tim, Andy is saying that Macrolite filters down to 3-5 microns and are used for rusty water filtration.

If your water from the well is clear, I would ask why the Macrolite filter, and then what is the need for the prefilter with its expense and additional pressure loss?

He is also saying that it is easy to misapply Macrolite, which sounds as if it has been in your case. It has if the water from the well is clear.

All waters contain some DO (dissolved oxygen) which will oxidize some of the ferrous iron in your disposable cartridge, that and any invisible dirt will discolor the cartridge.

Since the Overdrive control valve allows you to get water through both hour glass tanks (all 4 tanks) at the same time, and it regenerates immediately when the gallons count down to 0 then you only get water through the two tanks on one side.

That means you share your water use with the regeneration water flow to drain. That also means you are only getting water through one half the unit and that reduces the number of gpm the one tank can successfully treat. And sharing water with the regeneration reduces your pressure and flow rate. Your water use during regeneration reduces the water flow and pressure to the unit and more so with the prefilter, especially when it isn't needed. You can remove the cartridge from the housing and that will help increase your flow and pressure.

Andy, please correct any errors in what I have said, I don't want to tell Tim something that isn't true. But don't say I'm wrong without giving details as to why. BTW, I find many Kinetico softeners undersized on the SFR. Would you (or TIM?) have a picture of the label showing the SFR gpm for his unit with the size of the tanks?

[Andy CWS]

Tim, you don't need a prefilter with that unit. Just remove the element from the housing. Since you are getting chunks and indications of high iron, the Macrolite filter alone will be adequate.

The unit is rated at 11 gpm and 18 gpm peak flow rate. Peak backwash rate is 3 gpm.

Your system is not undersized unless you are supplying an apartment building or some other great demand.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

[Gary Slusser]

The unit is rated at 11 gpm and 18 gpm peak flow rate. Peak backwash rate is 3 gpm.

Your system is not undersized unless you are supplying an apartment building or some other great demand.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

Really! You think an 18 gpm @ 15 psi pressure drop across the unit is sufficient for an apartment building!! You can't be serious; especially when you don't mention the number of units in the building.... I sell equipment in houses that need more than 18 gpm. I'm quoting one today with 5.5 bathrooms and 6 people with a body spray shower and a large tub. Some showers regularly flow at 15-20 gpm.

Andy, what is the single/one tank SFR when the unit is in regeneration?

If you are saying it is 11 gpm, what flow rate (DLFC gpm) goes to drain and you do know that we have to subtract that from the single tank SFR right? If so that means the 11 gpm is reduced when he uses water during backwash or regeneration.

Also, since you say it is not undersized, what IYO is causing his problem is iron getting through the filter into the softener and through it when he uses water when the one tank is in regeneration?

Because he has 8 ppm of iron and the Macrolite is only rated at 1 ppm ferrous iron, the problem is misapplied equipment.

If the Macrolite were replaced with something to treat his 8 ppm of ferrous iron, then the unit is undersized for his demand when one half the overdrive unit is in backwash or regeneration.

[Andy CWS]

Tim,
Sorry, someone was confused. I never implied, mentioned or stated your equipment can be used for apartments and anything like that. Don't worry about someone else's misunderstandings.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

[Andy CWS]

Tim, I haven't heard from you lately. Since you said your water is clear of iron stains and soft, then your Kinetico is working. The tannin issue may still need to be resolved. That ferric iron is being removed. I am afraid I didn't agree that your system is misapplied, not without more information. It looks as though iot is working according to your description.

Can you see the number on the disk through the lens?

Perhaps the bed is not large enougn on the tannin filter.

Let us know what is happening with your water.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

[Tim Woods]

Information

The number on the disc is a three, Our water is very good @ the present time. On one of your eariler Emails you said you thought I could take out the 5 micron prefilter, when the system was first installed it did not have the prefilter, and the chunks I will call them caused the valve in the head to stick and had to be taken apart and cleaned to stop the water flow. I think/hope I bought a great system I just thought by adding the prefilter I could extend the life of the system, and save money in the long run. The discharge hoses on the Tannis filter and the discharge on the softner are both clear in color and so far have not been stained by the Tannis or the Iron, is that good/Bad/Ok The system uses very little salt and I use the green bag rust fighter type

Thanks

Tim

[Andy CWS]

Tim,

Thanks for getting back. Sorry to hear that the valve had trouble. But if the media in the top two tanks is Macrolite, then it is extremely strange that these chucks are getting into the valve mechanisms.

The media filters water down to between 3 and 5 microns. These limits have been tested and certified by the NSF labs. No unfiltered/unsoftened water passes through any disks, valves, pistons, gears, or any other moving parts. The water comes into 1.25" ports and goes immediately into the filtering media. There is no upper distributor, either.

So I am puzzled how the valve was affected as you mentioned. There are others with more experience with Tannin filters. I am not sure if drain/backwashing lines will be stained, but it seems likely that if they are clear, eventually they will be discolored somewhat.

Glad to hear the Kinetico unit is working.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

[Gary Slusser]

Obviously since chunks got through the Macrolite, it isn't filtering down to 3-5 mics. But then you did say the limit for iron was 1 ppm and he says he has 8 ppm, so just possibly the chunks were rust or IRB.

BTW, certification is done in a lab with controlled water temp etc. and spiked water, and as we know, water chemistry varies widely from one source to another. It may be a mistake to depend on lab data when the equipment is going to be used out in the real world. But aren't we lucky that most equipment sold is not certified but real world proven.

[Andy CWS]

Tim,

I sent a PM.
Andy