New site user needs service help!

[shelly]

Most of the local folks I have found are incompetent. Others have just tried to sell me their system, not help me with mine. Some even looked at the system, shook their head and said they didn't know!! I will only have someone who knows something about my system work on it. I'm not sure what the range for the various systems are, but we paid just under 3k for ours! I just can't believe we are having so much trouble getting someone to service it. We are very frustrated as you can imagine! Thanks again for all your help and insight, I'll let you know what happens next! Enjoy the holiday weekend!
Shelly

[Gary Slusser]

Most of the local folks I have found are incompetent. Others have just tried to sell me their system, not help me with mine. Some even looked at the system, shook their head and said they didn't know!!

I agree, most local dealers are incompetent and only want to sell new equipment, and then they whine that they are losing business to internet dealers.

If you can do the mechanical part, I can send you instructions on what and how to do it.

Andy is a Kinetico salesman. They are famous for replacing equipment rather than repairing or servicing existing equipment.

You'll notice he isn't saying much that could help you in any way and he suggests you buy another type of equipment when you already paid $3000 to a local dealer for what you already have.

[NH Master]

And we're off and running.... yet again

[Andy CWS]

Shelly,

I sent you a PM.

Have a great and safe Holiday....

[Driller1]

I agree, most local dealers are incompetent and only want to sell new equipment, and then they whine that they are losing business to internet dealers.

If you can do the mechanical part, I can send you instructions on what and how to do it.

Andy is a Kinetico salesman. They are famous for replacing equipment rather than repairing or servicing existing equipment.

You'll notice he isn't saying much that could help you in any way and he suggests you buy another type of equipment when you already paid $3000 to a local dealer for what you already have.

Why the personal attack on Andy? My money is with Andy any day.

[NH Master]

yea, I'd like to know where else I can get that "famous for" information from. Just like the assertion that most plumbers don't install filtration and water pumping equipment. Where are the facts to back that up?

[Gary Slusser]

Just like the assertion that most plumbers don't install filtration and water pumping equipment. Where are the facts to back that up?

What I said about most plumbers and most well drillers is that they don't know water treatment or how to troubleshoot and repair it, and most plumbers don't know how to size pumps. You can go into many forums and ask how many of each do those things or not. I've seen most of them say they don't get involved with those things.

[Akpsdvan]

Some Photos of the set up would be good.

It would help to make sure that all of us here are on the same page.

Some are not cross trained in different valves that are on the market.

[NH Master]

What I said about most plumbers and most well drillers is that they don't know water treatment or how to troubleshoot and repair it, and most plumbers don't know how to size pumps. You can go into many forums and ask how many of each do those things or not. I've seen most of them say they don't get involved with those things.

The number of plumbers and well drillers that are on forums of any kind is probably less than 1/10 of 1% of the plumbers and drillers working in the field so if that's where you are basing your comments you need to ammed it by adding "of those plumbers and well drillers that post on forums"

[Gary Slusser]

The number of plumbers and well drillers that are on forums of any kind is probably less than 1/10 of 1% of the plumbers and drillers working in the field so if that's where you are basing your comments you need to ammed it by adding "of those plumbers and well drillers that post on forums"

I also draw from my 18-19 years as a local water treatment and well pump dealer and recruiting plumbers to sell water treatment equipment and working with some that didn't want to sell it but gave me leads and I paid them a finders fee. Additionally, since mid 2002 I have been contacted by a few thousand consumers that tell me of their experiences with local plumbers that don't do water treatment.

[Driller1]

I also draw from my 18-19 years as a local water treatment and well pump dealer and recruiting plumbers to sell water treatment equipment and working with some that didn't want to sell it but gave me leads and I paid them a finders fee. Additionally, since mid 2002 I have been contacted by a few thousand consumers that tell me of their experiences with local plumbers that don't do water treatment.

Wow...what kind of a professional sells the names of their customers???

[NH Master]

Well then, that sums it up then. It must be true. several thousand customers all with plumber/well driller problems. What a world, what a world

If it were possible, and I doubt it is, I'd bet a years pay that there are far more plumbers and well drillers selling and installing filters than there are pump and filter guys doing the same. In the tri-city area I live in there are over 100 licensed plumbers ( I know, because I teach re-cert classes and have the list) There are 2 count them 2 pump and filter guys. Both of them run pretty small 1 to 2 truck operations and neither seems to be raking in the cash. My company alone probably outsells and installs them 10 to 1. It really pisses me off when someone throws ridiculous statements like that out there without a shred of evidence to support it other than their own perception. Many many plumbers sell and install. The equipment is simple, easy to install and if done by a licensed plumber will be installed to code which is something damn few filter guys do. It ain't rocket science. We regularly service and install equipment that is much more complicated than a valve head that lets water flow through a bedded tank, and yet some here would have you think that you need some magic training to do this. We get the "see my sizing chart" as if there is something special about a chart that was copied off a manufacturers web site and which, can be found on countless other sites along with the programming instructions. A water filter head is no more complicated to program than a set back thermostat. Yet in the same breath we are told that any DIY homeowner can do it. Which is it?, cause ya can't have it both ways.

[Gary Slusser]

Wow...what kind of a professional sells the names of their customers???

Who is selling the names of their customers?

The plumber had their customer that was interested in improving their water quality call me or, he handled the sale after giving me the data needed to size equipment and I gave him the info. In some cases his customer paid me and I paid the plumber and in others I sold to the plumber and his customer paid him whatever. In many cases the plumber installed the equipment which his customer paid him for.

[Driller1]

Who is selling the names of their customers?

The plumber had their customer that was interested in improving their water quality call me or, he handled the sale after giving me the data needed to size equipment and I gave him the info. In some cases his customer paid me and I paid the plumber and in others I sold to the plumber and his customer paid him whatever. In many cases the plumber installed the equipment which his customer paid him for.

You said you paid a "finder's fee".

I would never take money for the names of my customers.

[Gary Slusser]

Well then, that sums it up then. It must be true. several thousand customers all with plumber/well driller problems. What a world, what a world

Whatever the number, it seems to be many more than you have heard anything from.

In the tri-city area I live in there are over 100 licensed plumbers ( I know, because I teach re-cert classes and have the list) There are 2 count them 2 pump and filter guys. Both of them run pretty small 1 to 2 truck operations and neither seems to be raking in the cash. My company alone probably outsells and installs them 10 to 1.

There ya go, like most plumbers it's always about the money... And IMO we aren't talking about you or your immediate localized area small number of plumbers when compared to the national numbers.

It really pisses me off when someone throws ridiculous statements like that out there without a shred of evidence to support it other than their own perception. Many many plumbers sell and install.

Yes I know you get emotional quite easily, and many plumbers sell and install but that number is a small percentage of all plumbers on a national basis. Those that don't are the ones I'm talking about.

The equipment is simple, easy to install

I agree and yet many plumbers will not learn how to repair a control valve.

and if done by a licensed plumber will be installed to code which is something damn few filter guys do. It ain't rocket science.

Again I agree and yet again, DIYers can do it to code too IF THEY WANT TO. It is their house ya know, so silly me, I think that American homeowners have a choice to do it anyway they want to and they can suffer any consequences that decision causes them.

We regularly service and install equipment that is much more complicated than a valve head that lets water flow through a bedded tank, and yet some here would have you think that you need some magic training to do this.

This isn't about you and what or how you do things.

You may not need training to replace parts on a control valve but you certainly need experience to come up with what parts to replace to cure whatever problems there are with the operation of the equipment. And one of the problems I have with the plumbers my customers hire to do the installation and set up is that they know everything and refuse to follow instructions until they get it wrong and have to call me. Then some get emotional and hang up and muddle through for 30 minutes (thinking of their liability) and then call me again and shut up and listen to me and in 15 minutes they're done and it is done right.

We get the "see my sizing chart" as if there is something special about a chart that was copied off a manufacturers web site and which, can be found on countless other sites along with the programming instructions.

Actually that isn't a chart if you recall. It is a very detailed explanation of how to arrive at correct sizing and programming data. And I beg you to show me other web sites that get into that information with any detail.

A water filter head is no more complicated to program than a set back thermostat. Yet in the same breath we are told that any DIY homeowner can do it. Which is it?, cause ya can't have it both ways.

LOL so now you're saying that a DIYer kinda guy with a set back thermostat can't install it and/or program it!! LOL

The key is having the correct instructions and data to program a control valve with and only 1 or 2 of the other dealers selling Clack or otehr brands of control valves online give their customers the secret dealers side of the computer instructions or correct data to program with. You can go to their web sites and read their instructions for yourself as I have for years. While you're there, see if you can catch the error in their installation instructions.

Most plumbers selling water treatment equipment that I hear about and have talked to rely on the supply house to program the stuff they sell and they usually use max settings which provides their customer with terrible salt and water efficiency.